EP - 102
How Ledger Enterprise Keeps Crypto Companies Secure
with
Anne Bouverot, Pascal Gauthier & Charles Guillemet
Special Envoy of France for AI, CEO @ Ledger & CTO @ Ledger
Apr 09, 2025
This discussion delves into the intertwined revolutions of AI, blockchain, and quantum computing, exploring their complementary and contrasting aspects, the challenges of regulation, and the future of decentralization and digital sovereignty. Anne Bouverot, France’s Special Envoy for AI and a prominent figure in tech, joined Ledger’s CEO Pascal Gauthier and CTO Charles Guillemet to discuss these critical technological shifts.
“It’s a question of sovereignty. It’s a question of values also… I think it’s above anything else a question of freedom. This is not just good to have, this is a must-have and so this is a critical topic that I don’t want to be forgotten in the public debate.” – Pascal Gauthier
Key Highlights:
AI and Crypto: Intertwined Revolutions
The conversation highlights AI and crypto as being two revolutions that go hand-in-hand. Pascal Gauthier notes that while AI is about the abundance of data, crypto represents the scarcity of data. He also suggests that AI might eventually use public blockchains for automatic payments.
“With crypto, we can prove we are human; with AI, we are a robot.” – Pascal Gauthier
Cryptographic Proof for Humanity and Security
Charles Guillemet expands on how cryptography can be used to prove one’s humanity, for instance, by signing with an encrypted identity and selectively revealing information, potentially for applications like secure voting or online age verification.
Ledger’s Security Key was presented as an example of extending Ledger’s utility beyond just access to crypto by replacing traditional login credentials with cryptographic keys.
AI Agents and Crypto Payments: Emerging Security Concerns
Charles Guillemet highlights that while the potential for AI agents to create (and even directly sign) crypto transactions could make user experience much more natural, it poses security problems that also need to be resolved.
Watch the episode here:
The Burden of European Regulation
Both Anne Bouverot and Pascal Gauthier stress the inherent difficulty of regulation. Anne Bouverot observes that regulations like the General Data Protection Regulation (GDPR), despite good intentions, become “very heavy, bureaucratic, complicated” in their implementation.
Pascal Gauthier describes Europe as suffering from a sickness of regulation and overly heavy administration and administrative complexity that hinders entrepreneurs and innovation. He notes that while the AI Act’s consultation phase with businesses is a positive step, existing crypto regulations like MiCA can kill European business, leaving the market open for non-European competitors
“I always say that I think regulation is a very difficult job because the technologies are first complex and then evolve very quickly.” – Anne Bouverot
Bitcoin and Decentralization: Beyond Regulation
Pascal Gauthier asserts that regulation does not apply to mathematics, rendering Bitcoin, as open-source code, inherently difficult, if not impossible, to regulate. He contrasted Bitcoin’s decentralized, peer-to-peer nature with centralized exchanges, stating that “the last 10 years were the years of exchanges; the next 10 years will be more the years of decentralization”. He argued that digital private property, enabled by Bitcoin, is a “basis for freedom and democracy” and “ineluctable”. Public blockchains offer complete transparency, allowing for real-time or ex-post verification, making them less suitable for criminal activity than opaque traditional financial systems.
Building Global Tech Leaders from Europe
Pascal Gauthier offered insights into how Ledger became a global leader, emphasizing the need for European companies to “think extremely big and… position yourself where you have the best chances to win”. Key elements include leveraging high-quality French engineering, building security “without backdoors,” thinking globally from day one, and combining strong technology with effective American marketing and storytelling to target the largest markets, such as the US. He noted that Ledger’s international team, comprising around 34 nationalities, reflects the global nature of crypto.
Sovereignty, Values, and Freedom
Pascal Gauthier passionately underscored the importance of mastering and controlling these advanced technologies within national territories. He called for fighting European conservatism with “good arguments” and “education” to help people understand and embrace change. Anne Bouverot also highlighted France’s strong scientific and engineering expertise in both AI and blockchain as a national asset.